認真請教Ross 跟UCLA的兩難抉擇

[fayevanish]

先預祝各位傷心咖啡店的朋友都能申請上自己理想的學校!
小妹很幸運地在日前收到了這兩個學校的offer(admission的人大概是眼睛沾到泥巴了吧)
可是卻在做了越多的思考後越疑惑了......
在此很誠懇地請教學長姐或者任何有idea的朋友!

1. [天氣]
雖然講到天氣，有人會想打我，覺得怎麼會讓天氣成為一個考量因素。但因為我的身體不是屬於那種很能過冬的人(我很瘦......)，很怕到了那邊會一整個不適應天氣。
天氣不適應，其實生活上及心情上一定也會有所影響吧.......想到一年當中有四分之一的時間都被大雪淹沒，只能待在室內被暖氣烘著，感覺沒有辦法接觸到大自然呢......^^"

2. [location]
因為不是很清楚那邊的狀況，所以可能問的問題有些蠢.....希望學長姐們不要介意!
我是在想，UCLA在洛杉磯，是個大城市，相信許多大公司也會在那邊有據點。而Michigan聽說是個大學城(?)，純粹就它自己所在的地方應該不是就業主要的地點。不知道這對就業方面的影響是甚麼? 又或者其實並沒有影響?

3. [華人]
我現任的老闆以前自己是唸芝加哥MBA畢業的。她不建議我去加州唸書，原因是因為她覺得加州華人太多，去那邊沒有甚麼出去的感覺。如果要真正體會所謂"美國生活"跟"美國文化"，就不要去加州。
但我的想法是，其實我不是想要被美國文化跟生活所包圍浸淫(雖然我對美國文化的適應度跟接受度應該是夠高的)(而且我相信不管在哪個城市，都會有文化衝擊跟學習的)。主要還是在思考對於未來就業的影響。

例如說，會不會因為在加州，個性一整個慵懶了起來(有陽光沙灘加美女?喔對不起....那好像是邁阿密XD)?
會不會因為華人太多，比較沒有機會練習英文?
還是說反而因為加州華人多，或者說是台灣校友多，對於就業時會比較有幫助?



我相信這兩個學校都是很棒的學校，不管去哪個都能學習到很多。但畢竟人不在裡面，也沒有認識的朋友是念那邊的，所以很誠懇地希望能有台灣的學長姐給我們後輩一點心得或建議! (我真的有很認真在思考的今天所po出來的問題唷!)
話說小妹其實有時蠻笨的(朋友都說我沒有比野田妹聰明多少)，所以如果有任何提出的問題是很蠢的，請學長姐不要恥笑我>< 我會很認真地思考學習的!!

再一次地謝謝任何願意幫助我的人! 如果有人需要我的任何協助也請不吝提出，我也會盡己所能提供想法!
希望我們真的能不只為自己，也為這個社會盡一己之力!

[cburger]

Hi

First of all, congratulation on your admissions, and I just want to say beforehand that I am in USC right now, not UCLA, so I guess that would make my opinion slightly less biased...? hehe

1. LA's weather is great. You can count the number of rainy days in a year with 2 hands. The drawbacks are the traffic and the high living cost

2. If you see California as a country, its GDP is equivalent to that of Canada. There are many opportunities you can pursue, and having a local degree will definitely help you reaching out to the alumni network. Then again, perhaps you need to clarify what your career goal is. I'm not familiar with Michigan, but I do believe by being closer to the East Coast and one of the elite business school, Michigan *should* have more exposure to finance-related industries.

3. Many people asked me similar questions. Having been in LA for almost 2 years, my observations are:

a. How do you define "American Life" and "American Culture"? US as a whole is a very diversified country. The American experience can range from talking baseball with domestic students to being asked to stay with a white colleague in a rural town because "it's safer for you" (not my story, but true nonetheless). California, in particular, is very different than other parts of US, but it is an "American Experience"? I would definitely say yes.

b. California does have a sizable Asian population. My believe is that people tend to gravitate to doing something they are comfortable about and used to. Ultimately, though, it's their CHOICE to be comfortable. So you can't fault California for being a place where you can't practice more English. It is about how driven you are to want to improve your English.

c. California has a lot of business ties with Pacific Rim countries. If your ultimate goal is to work in Asia, you should see a lot of opportunities in California.

[Jason Lee]

Please correct me if I am wrong, but I assume your objective is to make money after your MBA degree. Who cares about leaning English? You might be able to Asia based companies pay as well as US based companies in California. You are at least twenty years old. Would you not feel more comfortable working in an environment surrounded by Chinese speakers? Would you like to be treated as a second tier citizen due to your inability to speak perfect English?

California is definitely a right place to live. You will be able to find everything you could possible find in Taiwan in California, particular southern California. You will be able to fly back home in 12 hours whenever you want (no connection flies). You will be able to find many Chinese and Taiwanese friends, and the best part is many of them are rich. It would be a great advantage for girls, and possibly guys, to find her/his significant other. You will find great Chinese/Taiwanese communities. Furthermore, the weather is nice and California has endless night clubs and parties. Would you want to give them all up?

[bald855]

Please correct me if I am wrong, but I assume your objective is to make money after your MBA degree. Who cares about leaning English? You might be able to Asia based companies pay as well as US based companies in California. You are at least twenty years old. Would you not feel more comfortable working in an environment surrounded by Chinese speakers? Would you like to be treated as a second tier citizen due to your inability to speak perfect English?

California is definitely a right place to live. You will be able to find everything you could possible find in Taiwan in California, particular southern California. You will be able to fly back home in 12 hours whenever you want (no connection flies). You will be able to find many Chinese and Taiwanese friends, and the best part is many of them are rich. It would be a great advantage for girls, and possibly guys, to find her/his significant other. You will find great Chinese/Taiwanese communities. Furthermore, the weather is nice and California has endless night clubs and parties. Would you want to give them all up?

You might be able to Asia based companies pay as well as US based companies in California.
===>
Which Asia-based company?

[mole]

個人覺得...UCLA好
具能使身心健康之環境, 求職之環境, 而英語華人..則是心態問題, 到哪都一樣

UMICH也很好, 近 Detroit, 求學環境好, 但中西部真的沒啥能刺激眼球的人文環境, 而且冬天天氣氣候惡劣
妳主管說的沒錯, 中西部(不是只有中西部)才有傳統的社區環境住家

妳應該會去 LA, CA 吧~

[Allenr]

Had to make the same decision 3 years ago...
Following are the factors you mentioned:

1. Weather: CA is much better than MI, period. But as a busy MBA student, the weather does not make much difference...

2. Loction advantage in terms of recruiting: Indeed LA is a much bigger city than Ann Arbor and even than Detroit. Yet, I seriously doubt that the recruiters set in UCLA is any larger/better than that of Michigan. If you have strong interest in Entertainment business, UCLA probably is the best school on earth. For any other field, UMich will give you an equal, if not better, shot.

3. Chinese: Your boss is right, but you have the option to resist the temptation hanging out only with Chinese/Taiwanese. Though, it is not easy...


In addition to the above comparison, I would advise you comparing the cost of living and the tuition fee. Since the "expected return" of these two schools can't be too different, the amount of investment should be a key factor in the valuation.

Last, go visiting the schools in person if you CAN, it is a very small investment comparing to the time and money you are going to spend..., the takeaway would be much more valuable than asking alumni of UMich or UCLA, let along asking those who are not familiar with these two schools by any means.

先預祝各位傷心咖啡店的朋友都能申請上自己理想的學校!
小妹很幸運地在日前收到了這兩個學校的offer(admission的人大概是眼睛沾到泥巴了吧)
可是卻在做了越多的思考後越疑惑了......
在此很誠懇地請教學長姐或者任何有idea的朋友!

1. [天氣]
雖然講到天氣，有人會想打我，覺得怎麼會讓天氣成為一個考量因素。但因為我的身體不是屬於那種很能過冬的人(我很瘦......)，很怕到了那邊會一整個不適應天氣。
天氣不適應，其實生活上及心情上一定也會有所影響吧.......想到一年當中有四分之一的時間都被大雪淹沒，只能待在室內被暖氣烘著，感覺沒有辦法接觸到大自然呢......^^"

2. [location]
因為不是很清楚那邊的狀況，所以可能問的問題有些蠢.....希望學長姐們不要介意!
我是在想，UCLA在洛杉磯，是個大城市，相信許多大公司也會在那邊有據點。而Michigan聽說是個大學城(?)，純粹就它自己所在的地方應該不是就業主要的地點。不知道這對就業方面的影響是甚麼? 又或者其實並沒有影響?

3. [華人]
我現任的老闆以前自己是唸芝加哥MBA畢業的。她不建議我去加州唸書，原因是因為她覺得加州華人太多，去那邊沒有甚麼出去的感覺。如果要真正體會所謂"美國生活"跟"美國文化"，就不要去加州。
但我的想法是，其實我不是想要被美國文化跟生活所包圍浸淫(雖然我對美國文化的適應度跟接受度應該是夠高的)(而且我相信不管在哪個城市，都會有文化衝擊跟學習的)。主要還是在思考對於未來就業的影響。

例如說，會不會因為在加州，個性一整個慵懶了起來(有陽光沙灘加美女?喔對不起....那好像是邁阿密XD)?
會不會因為華人太多，比較沒有機會練習英文?
還是說反而因為加州華人多，或者說是台灣校友多，對於就業時會比較有幫助?



我相信這兩個學校都是很棒的學校，不管去哪個都能學習到很多。但畢竟人不在裡面，也沒有認識的朋友是念那邊的，所以很誠懇地希望能有台灣的學長姐給我們後輩一點心得或建議! (我真的有很認真在思考的今天所po出來的問題唷!)
話說小妹其實有時蠻笨的(朋友都說我沒有比野田妹聰明多少)，所以如果有任何提出的問題是很蠢的，請學長姐不要恥笑我>< 我會很認真地思考學習的!!

再一次地謝謝任何願意幫助我的人! 如果有人需要我的任何協助也請不吝提出，我也會盡己所能提供想法!
希望我們真的能不只為自己，也為這個社會盡一己之力!

[Jason Lee]

You might be able to Asia based companies pay as well as US based companies in California.
===>
Which Asia-based company?

There are many mid-size Asia based companies having branches in California. However, this apparently is not the issue here, is it? We are discussing whether to stay in California or in Michigan. Personally, I would prefer to have an environment similar or at least comparable to the one we have in Taiwan.

American Culture is lost after 90’s. By 2050, White, not Hispanic is only going to be 50% of the total population while more than 25% population is going to be Hispanic. Is this the American Culture that many of our professors experienced back in 70’s or 60’s? It is certainly not. San Diego has already been taken over by Hispanic.

FYI: If you were planning to visit those two schools, please be advised to bring both winter coats and t-shirts. It is currently -8C ~ -13C in Ann Arbor, Michigan, and 12C ~ 14C in LA.

[ccuturandot]

我只能說 青菜蘿蔔 各有不同

我在東岸唸書 在西岸工作(San Fran) , 跑了相當多美國的都市
也到過LA待過三個月...以氣候來說 絕對是西岸為首選 在 LA ,
想吃台灣的東西去 Vaily Blvd 就有
生活方式也跟台灣很接近....在那邊唸書是很快樂的...

但是 我還是不後悔我到東岸唸書的經驗...
如同Allenr 說的 環境 是一個影響你很大的因素 你很難去抵抗在一堆
母語非英文的華人世界裡講英文....

大家想去體驗的是"白人文化" (加州也是美國文化的一種)....
在東岸 中部的學生都很清楚 那種在白人世界生活下的經驗
因為不喜歡 所以 我搬來舊金山 ( 白人文化 + 華人文化混合的地方) 工作
(東西岸有什麼差 我只能說 差很多 可是我不會形容......)
在學生生涯...我體會很多白人世界下的各種社交活動, 尤其許多有錢的白人
的奢華活動...大公司毫不手軟的晚會...東岸社會的快節奏, 東岸人很積歪的個性
西岸三大都市...越往北 , 越像東岸生活 ( 西雅圖的生活就很像我在東岸的感覺 ! )

工作機會來說 沒錯...LA是大都市 但是 大部分是中小企業 或者是TW based
的公司..如果要往娛樂業, 製片業發展...LA是首選 除此之外 我沒有看到任何
找工作的利基....因為我沒去過密西根....所以不給予評論...以保中立...
但是 應該它離芝加哥不遠...如果是志在金融業, 那 那邊應該搭個飛機很快就到了
敝校離紐約市有 4 小時車程, 雖然有點遠 但是金融重鎮就在那...一堆公司也是
願意跑來這邊招募, 我們也稍微辛苦一點開個車 就可以去華爾街了....

拉拉雜雜說了那麼多....不仿考慮 在東岸 or 中部唸書...到西岸工作 !
畢竟 這兩間學校的名聲都很響 到哪裡找工作都沒差的 !!

給您參考摟 !

You might be able to Asia based companies pay as well as US based companies in California.
===>
Which Asia-based company?

There are many mid-size Asia based companies having branches in California. However, this apparently is not the issue here, is it? We are discussing whether to stay in California or in Michigan. Personally, I would prefer to have an environment similar or at least comparable to the one we have in Taiwan.

American Culture is lost after 90’s. By 2050, White, not Hispanic is only going to be 50% of the total population while more than 25% population is going to be Hispanic. Is this the American Culture that many of our professors experienced back in 70’s or 60’s? It is certainly not. San Diego has already been taken over by Hispanic.

FYI: If you were planning to visit those two schools, please be advised to bring both winter coats and t-shirts. It is currently -8C ~ -13C in Ann Arbor, Michigan, and 12C ~ 14C in LA.

[fayevanish]

真的非常感謝各位學長姐寶貴的心得分享!!!!
看完之後有很多的體認跟釐清，但對於decision making卻好像越來越疑惑了><"

如果我把我未來的期望(好像就是所謂的short term goal和long term goal...:p)告訴各位學長姐，會不會對你們來說比較容易給明確的建議呢? 感覺起來因為我沒有明確說出未來的方向，反而造成你們給意見時的困擾....


其實我是一個沒有太大事業野心的人，但我的優點是做事很認真 而且學習能力還不錯
個性活潑，喜歡與人相處 不喜歡太單打獨鬥的那種工作

先說好喔......我沒有惡意......但我未來完全沒有興趣要進iBank那類的金融業，因為我不想花我的上半生努力賺錢，下半生努力用賺來的錢看醫生
更不希望助長像iBank這種世界經濟亂源的始作俑者:p(純粹個人意見!!)
(講那麼多，老實說以我自己的金融知識可能也進不去吧XD 我是個超級金融投資白癡:p)
而且，雖然我是個做起事來就拼命三郎的人，但我對於一個完整的家庭生活還是有嚮往的
所以不希望我的人生中只有工作，甚麼都沒有......(iBank就此出局!)

未來希望能往consulting嘗試看看，因為很希望能夠盡一己之力改變些甚麼。(當然，是讓世界變好的那種變喔)
如果不行，corporate 的marketing也不錯~~希望能做類似市場分析的那種
如果是corporate finance也行，我的想像中是類似financial planning的那種工作.......(不知道我想像的對不對?)
(其實我好像只要不是iBank的，其它也沒有設限太大耶......-.-||)


最後閒話兩句......
今天晚上我老媽跟我聊天時說，其實這兩個學校都是很棒的學校耶....你看你現在那麼煩惱，其實如果你是在沒有選擇性的情況下直接進入其中任何一所，只要你認真努力，未來的結果其實都不會太差吧.....(當然很多事情是上帝安排的，我們能做的也只有盡己之力而已)

話雖這麼說.....但，老媽啊......人家現在真的有煩惱啦!!



*再次拜謝各位學長姐及前輩的指點和分享!!!*

[維尼]

如果經濟與時間允許的話
飛去學校拜訪
跟學生聊天
甚至直接到教室一起上課
會讓妳比較清楚將來會是怎樣的生活

Anderson應該即將舉辦A-Days for admits
可以考慮參加一下唷 :)

[vc1209]

If you don’t mind the occasional meaningless, arrogant comments, maybe you can post the same question on the BW forum to get more discussions.

You can also go to the MBA Podcaster website to listen to the “Day in the life” series for both schools.

Ross is generally ranked within top 10 and viewed as a Top 10 school. So if you are highly concerned about the rankings, Ross would be the safer choice.

Other than rankings, I really don’t think either one is better than the other. It’s down to personal preferences.

Congratulations on the two admits!

[Jason Lee]

FYI: Please keep in mind that the “Day in the life” is based on local people’s stories. Individual results may vary. I wish they had international student versions.

[qixz_orig]

哇 你好厲害喔
兩間都是超級好的學校..
要是我會選 UCLA
因為我喜歡熱鬧的地方 而且大城市什麼都有...
今年競爭非常激烈
不知道可否分享一下背景與申請心得啊
謝謝~~

[維尼]

如果學費是你的顧慮之一的話
UCLA Anderson應該是比較便宜一些 :P

從career來看
大家聽過的consulting firm也都會來學校
McKinsey, BCG, Bain, Monitor, PRTM
Corporate function的話
Finance 是Anderson的強項
Marketing 也是挺不賴的
我想Anderson基本上是能夠提供足夠的機會
能否順利拿到工作就看個人背景和努力程度囉 :)

[modern]

1. Have never been to Ross
2. Have been to Anderson for 3 months
I can't compare the environment since I've never been to Ross.

But the only thing I wanna say is

I love Anderson, and I enjoy the life that I can have every kind of Chinese food when I really want to eat them, Period.