OG181, 109 (require的用法)

[agk99]

agk99 寫到:

你這一題是不是這樣解的
require of sb.to do sth..必錯，刪ABD
然後看到they是代pubs and bars，主動又錯，選C???

請問一下,require of sb to do sth 不是慣用嗎?
像是OG #181 (B) require of firms to survive...
但是OG #109 (A) requires of both public and private employers that...
這我一直搞不懂其中的差異

我在南陽影印店買的筆記是這樣寫的:
require + that S + V (should必省)
require + O. + to V
require + of sb. to V (of好像可以省略)
請指點迷津

[micht]

#109
是pay和pay做comparison所以必須以pay
the pay for jobs historically held by women VS. the pay for jobs requiring the compariable skills......

[agk99]

重點不是這
重點是 require of sb. to sth. 這個用法可不可以
明顯OG181是可以的
OG109的解釋卻說這是個不合文法的結構

require that ... V(假設語氣，可以用)
require of sb. that ....V(假設語氣，可以用)
但其他就有爭議了

謝謝hamaru的提醒，這題還得繼續討論

[micht]

我看了解釋
jobs requring comparable skills 和 jobs of comparable skills 之差

of
prep.
used to show possession, belonging or origin
ie) the lid of the box
employees of the company


ETS解釋..jobs 自己沒有comparable skills 也就是這個原因

還有其他解釋嗎?

PS: agk99 粉懶惰喔~~都不打題目 :(

[agk99]

181.Because of the enormous research and development expenditures required to survive in the electronics industry, an industry marked by rapid innovation and volatile demand, such firms tend to be very large.

(A) to survive
(B) of firms to survive
(C) for surviving
(D) for survival
(E) for firms’ survival




The subject of the main clause (such firms) presumes a prior reference to the firms in question. Furthermore, the logical subject of to survive and the logical complement of required should be made explicit. All three demands are met by B, the best choice. Choices A, C, and D, with no reference to the firms in question, meet none of these demands. In choice E, the illogical and awkward use of a prepositional phrase (for firms’ survival) buries the needed initial reference to firms in a possessive modifier.

************************************************
109.Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both public and private employers that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are usually held by men.

(A) that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are

(B) that pay for jobs historically held by women should be the same as for a job requiring comparable skills

(C) to pay the same in jobs historically held by women as in jobs of comparable skill that are

(D) to pay the same regardless of whether a job was historically held by women or is one demanding comparable skills

(E) to pay as much for jobs historically held by women as for a job demanding comparable skills




Choices C, D, and E produce the ungrammatical construction requires of... employers to pay, in which of makes the phrase incorrect. In C, the use of in rather than for is unidiomatic, and jobs of comparable skill confusedly suggests that the jobs rather than the workers possess the skills. In D, the phrase beginning regardless... is awkward and wordy in addition to being illogical.

[micht]

嘿~~動作真快~~乖喔~~ ;)

===

PS: 這一題再研究研究~~~~~~~~~~

[agk99]

看到這一題，才知道以前都在混，這麼重要的解釋差異，這麼就沒給找出來
先講對的，
require that...V
require of ... that V(以上兩種都用在假設法)
require sb to do sth...
以上都是可以的

剩下就是 require of sb to do sth.這種用法到底可不可以的問題...

先看OG109 的解釋

Choices C, D, and E produce the ungrammatical construction requires of... employers to pay, in which of makes the phrase incorrect.

不講別的，OG這裡就是點出requires of... employers to pay就是不行，沒得商量(注意這是主動)

回到181，解釋提到選B的三層概念

The subject of the main clause (such firms) presumes a prior reference to the firms in question. Furthermore, the logical subject of to survive and the logical complement of required should be made explicit. All three demands are met by B, the best choice.

1.原題主詞(such firms)如果沒有of firms，such就找不到對象
2.看到不定詞to survive，就該想想logical subject是誰
3.看到required(注意，過去分詞)，就得思考一下誰是logical complement
因此解答進一步闡述，補一個B，答案就對了

但我查了longman的字典，發覺有一個想法也可以討論看看
回到181題
(標準句型)
181.Because of the enormous research and development expenditures required of firms to survive in the electronics industry, an industry marked by rapid innovation and volatile demand, such firms tend to be very large.

原因子句還原後是這樣寫的
Because of the enormous research and development expenditures that are required of firms to survive in the......是被動式喔，以中文思考就是"由於大量的研發用是公司生存所需要" 進一步說，就是被動式可允許are require of sb to do sth...

但若改為主動，直接寫成"because firms require the enormous research and development expenditures to survive....."of 變的沒法加，也沒必要加了

所以結論，109解釋的並沒錯，但合併181，我們有以下結論
"require of sb to do sth. "is unidiomatic ...(不可用於主動)。
但 "..... are required of firms to survive in the electronics industry"(就可以了)，這裡的of可以理解為by，(用於被動，就可以加of)

[homaru]

原來如此
一解小弟心中疑惑
感謝~ (Y)

[魚]

看到這一題，才知道以前都在混，這麼重要的解釋差異，這麼就沒給找出來
先講對的，
require that...V
require of ... that V(以上兩種都用在假設法)
require sb to do sth...
以上都是可以的

剩下就是 require of sb to do sth.這種用法到底可不可以的問題...

先看OG109 的解釋

Choices C, D, and E produce the ungrammatical construction requires of... employers to pay, in which of makes the phrase incorrect.

不講別的，OG這裡就是點出requires of... employers to pay就是不行，沒得商量(注意這是主動)

回到181，解釋提到選B的三層概念

The subject of the main clause (such firms) presumes a prior reference to the firms in question. Furthermore, the logical subject of to survive and the logical complement of required should be made explicit. All three demands are met by B, the best choice.

1.原題主詞(such firms)如果沒有of firms，such就找不到對象
2.看到不定詞to survive，就該想想logical subject是誰
3.看到required(注意，過去分詞)，就得思考一下誰是logical complement
因此解答進一步闡述，補一個B，答案就對了

但我查了longman的字典，發覺有一個想法也可以討論看看
回到181題
(標準句型)
181.Because of the enormous research and development expenditures required of firms to survive in the electronics industry, an industry marked by rapid innovation and volatile demand, such firms tend to be very large.

原因子句還原後是這樣寫的
Because of the enormous research and development expenditures that are required of firms to survive in the......是被動式喔，以中文思考就是"由於大量的研發用是公司生存所需要" 進一步說，就是被動式可允許are require of sb to do sth...

但若改為主動，直接寫成"because firms require the enormous research and development expenditures to survive....."of 變的沒法加，也沒必要加了

所以結論，109解釋的並沒錯，但合併181，我們有以下結論
"require of sb to do sth. "is unidiomatic ...(不可用於主動)。
但 "..... are required of firms to survive in the electronics industry"(就可以了)，這裡的of可以理解為by，(用於被動，就可以加of)

大哥抱歉，魚淹死在酒桶裡．．．

關於　require of A to do 因為OG裡面沒有說的很清楚為何錯 ,

只說它非慣用語

同意 應該就是大哥所說的 主被動的問題
:D

[bear]

大哥講的真請楚~~~~看來以前我也滿混的 :P
讚讚~~~

ps.魚姊姊....你怎麼跑到酒桶裡面游泳了???

[micht]

good!! 之前都沒有注意到這點 感謝agk99題問這一點 讓我上了一課^_^

[訪客]

推,,,,真的解釋的粉讚
我昨天才有這個疑問,今天就解惑了
多多討論

[micht]

這一題一定要給agk99 鼓鼓掌
解釋的太詳細了

[josephko]

請教諸位關於跳躍修飾
(A )選項中的 that 跳過最近的skill 而去修飾jobs
除了靠它後面的 are去判斷that 修飾的對象
有沒有其他方法可以判斷出 that 就是修飾jobs呢

可以告訴我跳躍修飾的用法原則嗎? 謝謝囉

109.Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both public and private employers that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are usually held by men.

(A) that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are

[liwuu]

推agk99一個...自己之前也沒注意到!!感覺將整個require的用法複習一遍...棒

另外,josephko...的確用後面的動詞來判斷是最快的...然後再加上句意!!