[分享]台灣人於美國牛校入學人數之統計.

[Adam Cheng]

well...Not everyone wants to do IB or Consulting, probably only 60%~70%. And even if you want to do it, it still very competitive. Take Wharton as an example, there are more than 300 people want to do banking for the summer. Usually fewer than 40% of them can get into bulge brackets. For consulting, Mckinsey gave out at least 250 interview invitations this year. From historical figures, no more than 30 people can get summer offers. And these figures are including all the students, we as international students, it will be even thougher for us to compete.

謝謝 MBAboy 的熱情統計

但是 越看越辛酸啊..... 只有 60 人可以念所謂的名校嘛.... >_<

鳳毛麟角 只此四字可形容

雖然人家常酸MBA滿街跑沒價值

但是 這些出來不是IB就是Consulting

倒是價值不菲

大家加油吧

[Fego]

Tepper:
2004: 7
2005: 4

[fujen64]

Correct the number of FY students at Haas Berkeley 2005
There are 10 students directly from Taiwan
but only 2 from China

Jimmy

[knobhill18]

看完Adam Cheng大大的回應讓我想到去學校job fair一些公司是說明了不收international students,像美國big four 其中就有一家說明了不收國際學生(這個資訊假如不對請指正,不想誤導大家),感覺們越來越窄 (當然還是有很多工作空缺,只是可能薪水或是地點不好)

[MBABoy]

well...Not everyone wants to do IB or Consulting, probably only 60%~70%. And even if you want to do it, it still very competitive. Take Wharton as an example, there are more than 300 people want to do banking for the summer. Usually fewer than 40% of them can get into bulge brackets. For consulting, Mckinsey gave out at least 250 interview invitations this year. From historical figures, no more than 30 people can get summer offers. And these figures are including all the students, we as international students, it will be even thougher for us to compete.

Dear Adam,
may I ask how's the job market in Hong Kong, especailly for investment banking? I realize that it is really tough for international students to compete and stay in the US. But my focus is in HK, so I would like to ask this question if you don't mind. Second, in addition to some very top schools such as Wharton or Harvard, did you find many other students from top 15 compete for IB jobs in HK, and how's their performance?

I would like to utilize this opportunity to ask these two questions and hope this would give us some insights about the current situation of job hunting for these top Taiwanese students. Thank you very much!

[Adam Cheng]

Well...you probably ask the right person. I just accepted the IBD offer in HK. I can only comment this year. From the perspective of an international student like you and me, I can only give you 2 words: "extremely competitive."

Why? here are my 2 cents:
1. Who are going to apply the positions in HK?
a. people from Asia (including China, Korean, India, Singapore, etc)
b. Asian from US
c. Some US native students who can speak mandarin or are interested in Asia. (trust me, this number is increasing)

2. How many IBD summer offers in HK? (this year)
Goldman (5), Morgan (around 5), Merrill (around 5), JP (around 6), Citi (around 5), UBS (not sure, but probably fewer than 5), Lehman (probably fewer than 5), Credit Suesse (3), DB (around 5), HSBC (around 10) --> sum up, it's around 40~50

Honestly, our major competitors are those people, especially Asian from US. They are native in English, conversational to native level Mandarin, with decent US experience. And also some people they had banking or related experience before. They are pretty strong candidates too.

3. Maybe this year is more competitve because some press kept saying how much bonus bankers earn and therefore more people applied banking job. Goldman told me that they piled up all the resumes they received this year.....it's higher than a meter.

4. As far as I know, there are around 15 people received the offer and around 11 people are pretty sure to accept the offer. Out of 15, only 6 are directly from Greater China (Mainland, HK, and Taiwan)

5. As to people from other schools, I met some during the HK career trek and in some super day. I have to say some of them are pretty strong candidates especially from those top financial-orieted schools. As I mentioned before, good MBA program could open doors for you. You will have equal chances to compete. But how to stand out among all these strong candidates, that's the question you have to think about!!

Hope this helpful to you!!

well...Not everyone wants to do IB or Consulting, probably only 60%~70%. And even if you want to do it, it still very competitive. Take Wharton as an example, there are more than 300 people want to do banking for the summer. Usually fewer than 40% of them can get into bulge brackets. For consulting, Mckinsey gave out at least 250 interview invitations this year. From historical figures, no more than 30 people can get summer offers. And these figures are including all the students, we as international students, it will be even thougher for us to compete.

Dear Adam,
may I ask how's the job market in Hong Kong, especailly for investment banking? I realize that it is really tough for international students to compete and stay in the US. But my focus is in HK, so I would like to ask this question if you don't mind. Second, in addition to some very top schools such as Wharton or Harvard, did you find many other students from top 15 compete for IB jobs in HK, and how's their performance?

I would like to utilize this opportunity to ask these two questions and hope this would give us some insights about the current situation of job hunting for these top Taiwanese students. Thank you very much!

[MBABoy]

Well...you probably ask the right person. I just accepted the IBD offer in HK. I can only comment this year. From the perspective of an international student like you and me, I can only give you 2 words: "extremely competitive."

Why? here are my 2 cents:
1. Who are going to apply the positions in HK?
a. people from Asia (including China, Korean, India, Singapore, etc)
b. Asian from US
c. Some US native students who can speak mandarin or are interested in Asia. (trust me, this number is increasing)

2. How many IBD summer offers in HK? (this year)
Goldman (5), Morgan (around 5), Merrill (around 5), JP (around 6), Citi (around 5), UBS (not sure, but probably fewer than 5), Lehman (probably fewer than 5), Credit Suesse (3), DB (around 5), HSBC (around 10) --> sum up, it's around 40~50

Honestly, our major competitors are those people, especially Asian from US. They are native in English, conversational to native level Mandarin, with decent US experience. And also some people they had banking or related experience before. They are pretty strong candidates too.

3. Maybe this year is more competitve because some press kept saying how much bonus bankers earn and therefore more people applied banking job. Goldman told me that they piled up all the resumes they received this year.....it's higher than a meter.

4. As far as I know, there are around 15 people received the offer and around 11 people are pretty sure to accept the offer. Out of 15, only 6 are directly from Greater China (Mainland, HK, and Taiwan)

5. As to people from other schools, I met some during the HK career trek and in some super day. I have to say some of them are pretty strong candidates especially from those top financial-orieted schools. As I mentioned before, good MBA program could open doors for you. You will have equal chances to compete. But how to stand out among all these strong candidates, that's the question you have to think about!!

Hope this helpful to you!!

Dear Adam,
thank you very much!!!! It is very clear and I believe people who are interested in this field will also find your information helpful.

[MarkHsu]

I think an equally important point is that you must have relevant pre-MBA experience to get into IB.

Even if you attend a top school, but have no relevant work experience, the switch will be nearly impossible.

Some key factors:

--prestige of your undergrad (for Taiwanese students who did undergrad in Taiwan this would be "0")

--prestige of your pre-MBA employer

--pre-MBA work experience

[MBABoy]

Some key factors:

--prestige of your undergrad (for Taiwanese students who did undergrad in Taiwan this would be "0")

Hi Mark, do you mean that students attended NTU with major in Finance or BA and get dregrees from top business schools will be impossible to get into IB?

[MarkHsu]

Nope...that's not what I mean

What I mean is that attending undergrad in Taiwan does not give you an advantage.

Just based on my observations, I feel that the Finance world (IB/PE/VC/Asset Management) places a great emphasis on "pedigree."

so a "formula" that I have developed is:

undergrad + MBA must exceed a certain value....

for example...

NTU BA + Georgetown MBA would most likely be insufficient to get you into an IB

But,

a Berkeley BA + Georgetown MBA would....

Actually, the best path to get into the Finance world in Asia seems to be doing your undergrad in the US/Canada

[MBABoy]

Nope...that's not what I mean

What I mean is that attending undergrad in Taiwan does not give you an advantage.

Just based on my observations, I feel that the Finance world (IB/PE/VC/Asset Management) places a great emphasis on "pedigree."

so a "formula" that I have developed is:

undergrad + MBA must exceed a certain value....

for example...

NTU BA + Georgetown MBA would most likely be insufficient to get you into an IB

But,

a Berkeley BA + Georgetown MBA would....

Actually, the best path to get into the Finance world in Asia seems to be doing your undergrad in the US/Canada

I see. Thank you very much for your information! I wish people in Taiwan could get more insights from your know-how if we have more questions in the future.

[MBABoy]

1. Does anybody from Ross, MIT, or Dartmouth can verify the information for us? I haven't seen many people talk about these schools.

2. Does anyone apply for MIT or Dartmouth this year and already got admission?

[Adam Cheng]

I have to admit that being a int'l student (I mean non-native speaker) and career switcher, you have to put much effort on recruiting even if you get in one of the best b-school. The first thing you have to persuade your recruiter is: why I-banking?

I would like to further clarify the "relevant pre-MBA experience" here. It doesn't mean that you need to be an ex-banker. From my observation, consultanting experience in big name firms is always a good experience to make a transition. On the other side, because IB also has industry coverage groups, if you were in health care industry before, it will be a good experience to apply health care group. If you were engineer, it's good too. The only thing you have to demonstrate is more about soft skills and teamwork spirit.

Last thing is IB is people business and it's all about networking. Think as a recruiter, do you want to work with this guy at 3:00am in the morning? In case your flight delays, can you get along with this guy for 3 hours in the airport? Probably also ask yourself, can you really work 100+ hours per week and no weekend?

[knobhill18]

那 IB 可以說薪水是拿命換來的,想想一個星期沒有休息一天要工作14個小時才還不到100小時, 拼命阿

[Allenr]

1. Does anybody from Ross, MIT, or Dartmouth can verify the information for us? I haven't seen many people talk about these schools.

2. Does anyone apply for MIT or Dartmouth this year and already got admission?

Honestly, I am not sure whether this info would be useful or rather misleading, since my school does not have a definite quota for TW applicants. Even the school has a quota, it should be higher than the actual number of attendees. Anyway, here is what you asking for:

Ross School Business at UM:
Class of 2006 (enroll in 04): 7
Class of 2007 (enroll in 05): 4